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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:49 am 
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The Ovechkin story, in terms of him not staying with the Caps, looks like it has legs.

It might just be time for Ovechkin to play somewhere else to earn a Stanley Cup. It wouldn't be the first time a star player couldn't get it done with his 1st NHL team, but did find that success elsewhere (Brett Hull & Ray Bourque are two good examples).

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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:07 am 
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Yea I saw the full TSN story on it.

Despite the fact I started the thread that launched the discussion :P I have a hard time envisioning what another NHL team would be willing to part with in order to acquire Ovechkin.

The short answer is: A hell of a lot. It'd have to be a blockbuster and a half. If you're Washington you'd have to receive a bona-fide #1 RW sniper and that's just the starting point. Nobody else in the NHL is consistently scoring 50+ a year. So you're looking at maybe also a top 2 or top 3 defenseman, probably a first round pick if not multiple, a blue chip prospect or several lesser prospects... it'd be a LOT. There's also cap concerns.

Anaheim could maybe put together a package if you're talking Perry and one of their top defensemen they're looking to move.

Marchand is up there but he's mainly a center/left wing. Tarasenko, coincidentally. There's just not many guys scoring 30+ anymore much less 50+.

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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 12:04 pm 
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As a purely hypothetical, and I'm not advocating this trade ever happens... the Blues offer would have to be Tarasenko, Edmundson, both our 1st rounders and one of Schmaltz/Dunn/Walman. The return to Washington would be insane, so I don't think any team will actually agree to trade that much.

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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 12:21 pm 
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glen a richter wrote:
As a purely hypothetical, and I'm not advocating this trade ever happens... the Blues offer would have to be Tarasenko, Edmundson, both our 1st rounders and one of Schmaltz/Dunn/Walman. The return to Washington would be insane, so I don't think any team will actually agree to trade that much.


Yea exactly. It'd be something of that flavor for them to even pick up the phone. They'd likely demand a better defenseman/better additional offensive player/three years of first rounders/whatever. It could go so many directions but it'd be a price so few teams would pay.

It'd really have to be two teams almost desperate to shake things up. I don't know that any other team is AS desperate as Washington to mix up its roster to that degree, and to do so immediately. MAYBE Anaheim? San Jose? Rangers? Us?

edit: And as was kind've discussed in the actual thread on the topic, there are going to be changes that HAVE to come to the Capitals roster this offseason due to all the UFA and RFA action going on so the GM doesn't even necessarily "need" to move Ovie for the sake of making changes: he has other directions he can go and plenty of decisions that need to be made.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:06 pm 
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Drouin traded to Habs.

Habs get Drouin + conditional 6th round pick
Lightning get Sergachev + conditional 2nd round pick

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:34 pm 
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cardsfan04 wrote:
Drouin traded to Habs.

Habs get Drouin + conditional 6th round pick
Lightning get Sergachev + conditional 2nd round pick


Just saw it on TSN. That's a huge trade. Yzerman really must not have felt Drouin would be a long term fit or simply wanted to keep the other guys more than him but man... it's hard to trade that kind of talent away.

Sergachev is going to be a stud.

One of those rare trades that works for both teams: Habs desperately need an offensive punch and the Bolts needed to solve a seriously problematic cap/expansion draft problem and pick up a blue chip defensive prospect in the process.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 11:05 pm 
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WaukeeBlues wrote:
cardsfan04 wrote:
Drouin traded to Habs.

Habs get Drouin + conditional 6th round pick
Lightning get Sergachev + conditional 2nd round pick


Just saw it on TSN. That's a huge trade. Yzerman really must not have felt Drouin would be a long term fit or simply wanted to keep the other guys more than him but man... it's hard to trade that kind of talent away.

Sergachev is going to be a stud.

One of those rare trades that works for both teams: Habs desperately need an offensive punch and the Bolts needed to solve a seriously problematic cap/expansion draft problem and pick up a blue chip defensive prospect in the process.

The other part of this is the Lightning players who missed this season due to injury. If Stamkos and Callahan actually play most of a season, with the Lightning's depth, Drouin wouldn't be getting the ice time he received this season. He'd likely be pushed to a 3rd line role and salary had to go somewhere.

Ashame the Blues couldn't have made a similar deal with one of their defenseman, not named Parayko.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:47 pm 
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I don't know anything about Sergachev, so I'm not sure what our equivalent is. A player I know nothing about plus a conditional 2nd rounder seems like something I would have liked to have matched though. Drouin would be a great fit here, on the ice anyway. Not sure what to make of him in a locker room.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:19 pm 
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cardsfan04 wrote:
I don't know anything about Sergachev, so I'm not sure what our equivalent is. A player I know nothing about plus a conditional 2nd rounder seems like something I would have liked to have matched though. Drouin would be a great fit here, on the ice anyway. Not sure what to make of him in a locker room.


Don't worry- we've got Lehtera.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 7:08 pm 
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gaijin wrote:
cardsfan04 wrote:
I don't know anything about Sergachev, so I'm not sure what our equivalent is. A player I know nothing about plus a conditional 2nd rounder seems like something I would have liked to have matched though. Drouin would be a great fit here, on the ice anyway. Not sure what to make of him in a locker room.


Don't worry- we've got Lehtera.
:doh:

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 8:44 pm 
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Looks like Brian Elliott is going to hit the free agent market with Calgary having acquired Mike Smith from Arizona.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 6:44 am 
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theohall wrote:
Looks like Brian Elliott is going to hit the free agent market with Calgary having acquired Mike Smith from Arizona.


Which is bad for us. I think Elliott staying more than 1 season was a condition for a pick in the trade.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 2:12 pm 
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Hi Doug,
Thanks for renting players to opponents and not getting anything real in return...

Looks like you will be 2 for 2 in not getting picks for traded UFAs not staying on team to which they were traded.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 2:26 pm 
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theohall wrote:
Hi Doug,
Thanks for renting players to opponents and not getting anything real in return...

Looks like you will be 2 for 2 in not getting picks for traded UFAs not staying on team to which they were traded.


To be fair, at least he got something for Elliott and Shattenkirk while they still had some value. By the end of this last season, based on their play, each one was worth less than when he was in St. Louis.

Of course, it's not like we got much for Elliott to begin with...

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:02 pm 
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theohall wrote:
Hi Doug,
Thanks for renting players to opponents and not getting anything real in return...

Looks like you will be 2 for 2 in not getting picks for traded UFAs not staying on team to which they were traded.

To be fair on this part, you don't make those deals expecting that those guys are going to get retained by the team you're dealing them to. If it happens, great - you got a bonus pick.

Still doesn't fix that he screwed himself on trading Shattenkirk, but that horse has been (and will continue to be) beaten to death.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:38 pm 
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Irish Blues wrote:
theohall wrote:
Hi Doug,
Thanks for renting players to opponents and not getting anything real in return...

Looks like you will be 2 for 2 in not getting picks for traded UFAs not staying on team to which they were traded.

To be fair on this part, you don't make those deals expecting that those guys are going to get retained by the team you're dealing them to. If it happens, great - you got a bonus pick.

Still doesn't fix that he screwed himself on trading Shattenkirk, but that horse has been (and will continue to be) beaten to death.

I was referring more to Elliott, than #22. Had Els not shit the bed the 1st quarter of the season and then in the playoffs, he likely gets re-signed and the Blues get that pick.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:49 am 
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I would argue that there was much more of a return from the Shattenkirk trade than the picks and bodies we got. Once he was out of town, Edmundson blossomed. We overrate Shattenkirk because he was the best player in the trade when we got him, but the word is out that he's a defensive liability who can't switch sides. I can say for certain that if he signs with the Rangers as expected, the talk on the local sports radio come January/February will be people calling in to complain about his lack of defensive acumen and blasting Jeff Gorton for shelling out the money to sign him when they could have kept Dan Girardi to do the same thing.

I applaud Doug Armstrong for very little, but for trading Shattenkirk when he did I have to give major kudos.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:04 am 
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glen a richter wrote:
I would argue that there was much more of a return from the Shattenkirk trade than the picks and bodies we got. Once he was out of town, Edmundson blossomed. We overrate Shattenkirk because he was the best player in the trade when we got him, but the word is out that he's a defensive liability who can't switch sides. I can say for certain that if he signs with the Rangers as expected, the talk on the local sports radio come January/February will be people calling in to complain about his lack of defensive acumen and blasting Jeff Gorton for shelling out the money to sign him when they could have kept Dan Girardi to do the same thing.

I applaud Doug Armstrong for very little, but for trading Shattenkirk when he did I have to give major kudos.


:plusplus:

Watching the guys fill the void seamlessly without Shatty in the lineup was great to see. There wasn't a single point this playoff year I thought to myself "Man I miss Shattenkirk." The younger guys stepped up and filled it in.

Shattenkirk, in my opinion, worked out beautifully. Anything we got for him, IMO, is pure gravy. We free'd up cap space and ice time. Those are valuable commodities in and of themselves.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:15 pm 
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glen a richter wrote:
I would argue that there was much more of a return from the Shattenkirk trade than the picks and bodies we got. Once he was out of town, Edmundson blossomed. We overrate Shattenkirk because he was the best player in the trade when we got him, but the word is out that he's a defensive liability who can't switch sides. I can say for certain that if he signs with the Rangers as expected, the talk on the local sports radio come January/February will be people calling in to complain about his lack of defensive acumen and blasting Jeff Gorton for shelling out the money to sign him when they could have kept Dan Girardi to do the same thing.

I applaud Doug Armstrong for very little, but for trading Shattenkirk when he did I have to give major kudos.

I don't disagree with your 1st paragraph at all. I still ding the shit out of Armstrong, though, for needlessly backing himself into a corner with Shattenkirk - especially when we all knew at least 2 years ago that he was going to get dealt, and all his warts were known to us and weren't getting any better.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:00 am 
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If the reports about deals being in place with other teams... Edmonton and Tampa Bay... were true, you can't totally fault Armstrong because Shattenkirk was strong-arming him into dealing him to specific teams.

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